Yesterday I read a question on an online Facebook group about the 5 boxes which (basically) read…
“I’ve learned the 5 pentatonic boxes, now what?”
Which, sadly, is an extremely common question… so today I’m going to tackle the answer.
First, let’s look at why you learned those 5 boxes, shall we?
My guess is that someone, somewhere, told you that you needed them. And while that’s not totally untrue, it’s not totally correct either.
What you need is the pentatonic minor scale (which, with one additional note also is the minor blues scale) because it’s the quintessential sound of the blues. The “boxes” are simply one way of compartmentalizing those notes into a way we can play them and find them easily.
So, let me be clear, the 5 boxes are a guitar thing, not a music thing. If you ask a piano player to play box 1 he’ll think you’re crazy.
Are there other ways to organize and remember the pentatonic and blues scales? You bet! But the boxes tend to be pretty common. In fact, my 4 note solo pattern is simply the top part of box 2.
So what you have with the 5 boxes is 5 different ways to play the same 5 notes… no more, no less.
Do you need all 5? Certainly not at first. In fact, of all the hundreds of solos I’ve transcribed from Albert King, SRV, Clapton, and others, box 1 and the extensions (parts of boxes 2 and 5) seem to cover 80-90% of what gets used commonly.
In other words, if you aren’t making music with box 1, and maybe a little bit extra, the problem is not that you need more notes!
In fact, what you need are the other 2 legs of the soloing tripod, complete solos, and licks…
And a better understanding of how to use Rhythm Figures in your blues lead playing (rhythm isn’t just for chords!)
So first, I’d suggest learning a complete solo that uses nothing but box 1. And if you prefer it in a swing feel I’ve got it that way too.
And then, maybe learn a few licks from great players like Peter Green, or maybe learn one by Johnny Winter, and maybe even some Clapton.
Finally, make sure you take time to just try stuff over jam tracks. And if you need some tracks to play over, I have some great blues backing tracks you can use to try stuff out.
Of course, if you want it all, all the time, the Blues Guitar Unleashed All Access Pass is the most cost effective way to start and you can try it for just $1.
35 replies to "The 5 Boxes? Now What?"
Definetly, intervals before boxes, for me. The boxes and scales are made of intervals. Nothing is made of boxes… except too much and they can be mind-traps.
There are only two intervals within the pentatonic scales… 3-fret intervals and 2-fret intervals and each of the penta-boxes follow the same pattern, with the roots being on different strings. There are (3) 3-fret intervals and (3) 2-fret intervals in each box, as I see them.
I guess boxes are not without merit but intervals are the key to all boxes, not the other way ‘round. Boxes tend to interupt my view of intervals up and down the fretboard. If someone asks me what box I’m in, with the exception of box-1, I do not know without stopping to think about it and thnking throws my timing off while playing and trying to listen. Intervals are freeing, in that regard.
Hello Griff
I really dig the whole lesson. It’s like you have these tutorials through out the lesson that emphasizes on techniques and subjects you’ve discussed before along with what you’re covering of what this whole lesson is all about. Great lesson!
Alexander
I didn’t learn the boxes as fingering patterns which is what most on line lessons teach. I learned them as intervals.The are five “ boxes” because there are five notes in the minor pentatonic scale. Root flat 3, 4, 5, and flat 7. Each “ box” just starts on a different note of the scale. So e/g’ a/ b/ and d is box 1. The next “box” starts on the flat third which is G So box 2 is g a b d and e. You then start on the fourth, in this case A etc. There are three frets between the root and flat third and fifth and flat seventh and two between the rest. I found this the easiest way to learn because you can start on any of the notes of the pentatonic scale on any string and determine how many frets between the next note. For example if you start on the seventh fret of the A string you start on E and three frets up is G which is the flat third. If you start on an A eg fret ten on the B string you go up two frets to hit the fifth which is B. You can start on any note of the pentatonic minor on any string and use the fret spacing to find the next note. I found that using intervals and the number of frets is far more helpful than memorizing the fingering pattern for each of the boxes.It’s a little slower starting out but once you have it Makes more sense than simple fingering patterns and boxes.
Just my opinion.
Everybody has their own learning style and one size doesn’t fit all. I agree 3with the interval method vs memorizing five patterns. Learn one pattern and use in in any key, on any string. Do this with the major scale too . .. It only took 20 years for me to figure tat out …..
Ian
You can easily get bogged down with the “boxes”. Single-string intervals are good for breaking, connecting and moving between the various scale positions up and down the neck. IMHO – intervals should be engrained before boxes.
Can one of the learned ones draw the diagram of each box. I do not kno w hat you all are talking about. Thanks.
FYI, there are many charts all over the net, including BGU Just Google 5 Pentatonic boxes, then copy them down, and practice ,practice, practice .
Good luck.
Hi Rosella,
There are diagrams of bowes all over the internet. Download and print the clearest ones. Have them on the wall with Box 1 on top. When you’ve learned it and CAN USE IT WITH SOME EASE, put it to the back and get Box 2 up, etc.
Good advice Griff. This is very helpful and should especially be encouraging to many of the newer players.
okay this is good information . something i already know . learning the tone pitch change can be hard. but there are more than 5 notes . there 7 yes. ? besides that you do not need more than 5 in a solo . is that correct? i have studied music for more than 45 years. i have never learned any more than the 4 note solo . the bends create more notes done well you can generate a lot of solo time with it. but that is not enough . i jammed with a guy this week and asked him to play a dm7 one of the saddest cords known and he had no clue . he has played in my band as a solo fill for a long time . I was a bit miffed on that . He knew the barre cord on the 6th fret but not on the first. see what i mean about tones . perhaps he needs to learn the cage system better . I do not use it much. I do not copy Your solos Griffin . Instead I learn solos to the songs I have worked on for years . You helped to learn more about some of the tunes that You have demoed here thanks for that . later Man .
Funny you put this out now. I just put a question on the Forums about the boxes. Got great feedback from some other BGU followers. I will begin putting the boxes in my practice and warm up to learn them. This helps me to know that working on rhythm and the box 1 solos is where I need to be for now.
Thanks Griff.
I have learned from professionals about chemistry, math, physics, aviation, other stuff too, the “nuts and bolts” of things, how stuff works.
But not music. I can’t read music, never had a lesson other than BGU. , Griff, you taught me those same basic skills, thank you, but you gave me something ethereal, almost surreal. I no longer see the fretboard as sets of boxes, able to play solos over any “key”,. Perhaps not a great. feat for those with talent, but after 50 years of very poor ability on guitar, I can hold my own,. And for that, Griff,
I owe you an eternal debt of gratitude.
Thank you, my Blues brother.
Boxes 1,2 and 5: those are the ones I remember. I particularly like the “trick” you showed of using boxes 1 and 5 to switch between major and minor blues IN THE SAME key. Keep rocking and teaching
Hey Griff
Happy New Year to you and everyone here.
Thank you very much I learnt alot from you.
You’re an awesome guitarist and a very good teacher.
God bless you
gOOD TO KNOW THAT ALL BOXES ARE NOT NEEDED TO GET GOIING. THANKS GRIFF.
Griff, I’v learned alot from you and enjoy your lessons.I love your candidness and your ability to make it look simple . I’ve played for over 50 years .now I’m retired and you are an inspiration to me .thank you for sharing your golden nuggets .
Hey Griff you are the number one man I love work with guitar I buy every thing you own I been playing blues 30 years and gotten gold from you thanks very much I love you man. Kp
Hi Griff,
As always you are an excellent teacher of blues guitar. Have been following you for a few years and have never been disappointed! What an great and thoughtful Christmas gift you have given us all. Still working on the five boxes, but I concentrate on putting blues feelings into the notes. Like your four note blues bars. God Bless you and your family and a very Merry Christmas.
WELL, WAY BACK WHEN I FIRST STARTED OUT WITH YOU GRIFF, I HAD NO BOX’S I NEW OF. THEN YOU HAD ALL 5 BOX’S ON A VIDEO BLOG. SO I PRINTED IT OOUT. YOU DID SAY TRY AND LEARN THEM, BUT TAKE ONE BOX AT A TIME. WELL, I GOT TO BOX 2 AND PLAYED THE OTHERS,BUT JUST SHINED ON THE 3-5BOX’S. I DID FIND THE NOTES I WANTED ALL OVER THE FRET BOARD WITH JUST BOX 1 AND 2. PLUS THE DORIAN SCALE. WHICH WORKS NICE IN AMONOR BLUES BOX 1.
NOW!! DEGITIC HAS THIS NEW PEDAL. “MUSIC TRIO IIN A BOX. HAS ALONG LOOPER AND MANY AFFECTS SO YOU CAN ACCULALY MAKE YOUR OWN BAND IN THE BOX. YOU CAN LOOP A RTHYUM, LEAD BOTH INTO THE LOOPER THEN SLECT YOUR SOUNDS. HAS BASS , SLAP BASS AND IT JUST DOES EVERYTHING FOR YOU. THE YOU CAN SVAE THEM ONAN SD CARD. CHECK IT OUT AT SWEET WATER, OR GO TO MSN.COM. THEY HAVE IT ON THERE HOME PAGE. FOR GET JAM TRACKS. THIS IS THE BONE!
Man, again you are absolutely right. I was just watching Tinsley Ellis play Kiss of Death on you tube and in this slow blues you can really see him milking the Bm and Em pentatonic scales so tastefully it is an eye opener. Tinsley uses every method taught by Griff Hamlin in this piece of guitar virtuosity!
Never saw this before Steven, thanks for mentioning it. Gotta like Tinsley he seems to play effortlessly.
I have to agree, that video complements Griff’s lesson quite well. Tinsley uses a lot of quiet space and a wide variety of rhythm figures in this slow blues. His dynamic choice of notes/rhythm/slurs/spaces makes it an excellent example of slow blues. Tinsley shows you don’t need to be a fast shredder, or a lot of notes, to play the blues.
Hi Griff, as you know i love your lessons and your blog ect ect .
I agree you don’t need to learn all the boxes to start with,but from my experience you should not attempt the boxes untill you have learned or learnt the chords that blues are based around.
I say this because take the jam track away and your down the river with out a paddle.
You need the major chords and a must is 7 th and 9 th chords and your playing Gary moores songs you will need the circle of 5ths and diminished chords.
Once you have the essential chords basics then learn a lick in minor and major in the same key lets say G.
This then opens the door to play a major lick or a run of notes over the 1 chord,then minor licks over chords 4 and 5 and then there’s the blues right there and that blew my mine when It clicked and I started to understand rhythm is the key as if you can’t feel the groove you can not solo with feel.
I listened to some of my old recordings and I could now hear my mistakes over and over again but you have to learn some how and making mistakes and learning why you made them is the best lesson you can get.
But having a teacher like griff is worth the wait in gold
Absolutely! Chords are paramount and I certainly don’t mean to imply otherwise. This article assumes the chords are in place.
this is an entire mini course in itself…great info and reminders in your shared links…I can’ think of anyone else that would put so much in one lesson…thanks…later.
cowboy
Wow! Yeah, Cowboy, my thoughts exactly. This is another one of those Griff’s gems that I think has tons of great content. He not only discusses the use of the boxes…he then talks about the next steps in incredible detail! I figured if I just took this blog and worked through all the links and ideas, it’s at least a 3 month course! Thank you Griff!
I “play” for myself. Which often reflect my feelings or emotions .
Sort of a “back to basics” reminder. Good idea, as always. Thanks.
The blues pentatonic scale is just like a pallet of colors…..you still have to paint the picture.
TIM. WELL SAID.
You just got to put your time in. Plain and simple. I’ve been going over them for the past 2 yrs and just keep picking up little things,runs,licks and now it’s like double or tripled all the stuff I was doing before. It’s been more of listening to what I’ve been playing and what notes or sounds I’m trying to find that keeps building on what I’ve been playing.
I’ve learnt the 5 boxes the last few months and having a ball ,time to mix in some major notes now.
“Learned”. Trying to improve spelling ..one word ata time. LOL.
“Learnt” is also correct, but much more common in British English than the American variant.
Two years ago when I started bgu you posted the same comment about srv, BB,and others who mostly stayed in box one and two. I’ve taken that to heart as I’ve not ventured past box two except to noodle a little.I agree with Griff to much info can be confusing.Can’t see the forest for the trees as they say.Griff I hope I can meet you one day to say thx! You’ve made a Huge difference in my playing ability B-)