DAW Studio One-Arm Master Track?

Discussion in 'Recording Tips and Tricks' started by MikeS, Jul 23, 2020.

  1. MikeS

    MikeS Allen, TX
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2009
    Messages:
    4,192
    Likes Received:
    3,124
    When I start a new song in S1, I select "New Song" then, in the New Song dialog under Interfaces, I select StudioLive AR8 USB Session. When it loads, all 8 tracks AND the Master tracks are armed.

    What does arming the Master track do. I've recorded with it armed and not armed and I can't hear a difference.

    I know I don't have to load the whole StudioLive AR8 USB Session and could just ADD TRACK, but
    the Master Track question would still exist... To arm or not to arm... That is the question.
     
  2. CaptainMoto

    CaptainMoto Blues Voyager

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2012
    Messages:
    8,138
    Likes Received:
    6,438
    When a track is armed, it will begin recording when you hit the start record button.
    If you have all 8 tracks armed they will record any signal present on each of those tracks.

    If the master track is armed, you will also be recording the stereo sum of all those channels coming from the mixer.

    Net result would be two recordings happening simultaneously, 1) 8 individual tracks, 2) the stereo sum of all tracks.

    There could be some benefit to having both but for mixing purposes, I'd mute the master and make your mixing adjustments (in studio 1) on each individual tracks.
     
    #2 CaptainMoto, Jul 23, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2020
    MikeS likes this.
  3. Elwood

    Elwood -----------

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2018
    Messages:
    857
    Likes Received:
    846
    Is it necessary to mute the master, or is simply not arming it sufficient? Yeah, I'm jumping in the S1 pool too, S1 5 artist. I want to see if some things might just make more sense to me in S1, after a fair adjustment period. So far, very interestingk...
     
  4. PapaRaptor

    PapaRaptor The Central Scrutinizer
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2010
    Messages:
    7,143
    Likes Received:
    11,314
    The master track (as I understand it) mirrors your main outputs to FOH.
    The master will reflect all mixing operations you make on the StudioLive including fader level, panning, EQ, etc.
    The individual channels will be dry, pre-fader unaffected by fader level, panning, EQ, etc.
    I think it's meant to be used more as a reference track than a part of any final mix.
    I liken it to buying a cake (Master track) vs. making a cake from scratch ingredients. Anything you do to the master track in Studio One will affect everything in the master track. Working with individual channels, you have the ability to make the final product sound a whole lot different.
     
    #4 PapaRaptor, Jul 23, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2020
  5. PapaRaptor

    PapaRaptor The Central Scrutinizer
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2010
    Messages:
    7,143
    Likes Received:
    11,314
    Not arming it is sufficient. That way it will not be recorded (and not take up space on your hard drive). Muting it and leaving it armed will record a stereo track of silence, which is completely useless.

    Edit: I went and took a look at the 68c If you use the 68 template in Studio One, you will have the option of 2 stereo inputs, consisting of the front panel inputs 1&2 for your first stereo input and the back panel inputs 3&4 for stereo channel 2. If you create mono channels, each of the 4 inputs may be used as you choose. As @CaptainMoto mentions in a post after this, you will not have a stereo master channel within the 68 template.
     
    #5 PapaRaptor, Jul 23, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2020
    Elwood likes this.
  6. CaptainMoto

    CaptainMoto Blues Voyager

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2012
    Messages:
    8,138
    Likes Received:
    6,438
    Arming will cause that track to record, if you don't think you'll use it, don't arm it.
    Muting will silence the track but, it will still be recorded if it's armed.
    Choosing how/what you do will depend upon how you wish to use the tracks.

    I don't believe there is any disadvantage to recording the master track with one exception.
    Having that track in on your mix page could cause some confusion while your mixing, you'd have to make sure it's muted while you mix.

    That issue will only come up if your mixer is sending individual tracks and the muti-track master to Studio One.
    If you're using an interface (that's not a mixer) you will not have a master track to deal with.
     
    Elwood likes this.
  7. Elwood

    Elwood -----------

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2018
    Messages:
    857
    Likes Received:
    846
    upload_2020-8-1_9-46-0.png

    my Papa template at work. :)
     
    #7 Elwood, Aug 1, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2020
  8. CaptainMoto

    CaptainMoto Blues Voyager

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2012
    Messages:
    8,138
    Likes Received:
    6,438
    Hmm,
    You've got me confused o_O
    What's a 68c?
    From the print screen you show i don't see a master track.

    Whenever you are recording all the tracks will be sent to a MAIN OUT!
    That's different from a Master track.
    It is a combination of all tracks that allows you to hear everything in the mix, it is not a separate track
    That's what I see on your post.
    When you do a Mixdown a new Master track is created, it is the final version of what you hear in the main out.


    Using your example, if you had a master track it would be a separate track that was equal to the main outputs.

    Hope I didn't confuse the situation.:rolleyes:
     
  9. Elwood

    Elwood -----------

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2018
    Messages:
    857
    Likes Received:
    846
    I demonstrated my abject lack of understanding and just like when a guy falls, hops up, and acts like it was on purpose,:mad: I tried to edit part of my post so as to possibly mask my inherent dumbass qualities.:) Failed, you caught me:eek:
    the 68c is a nice little "interface" and as such displays the properties you correctly described.:thumbup:
    My post was toast.:thumbdown:
    You, Papa and the rest are right on top of it though and as always I appreciate your patience.:thumbup:
    Gazintas and gozoutas, whooo boy!
    Cheers :Beer:
     
  10. Elwood

    Elwood -----------

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2018
    Messages:
    857
    Likes Received:
    846
    @CaptainMoto this could be part of my cornfusion. My old setup has a master track. I hadn't realized it had gone missing when I went to the new setup.

    upload_2020-8-1_18-19-0.png

    Until I experiment I don't know it the master track was a function of Reaper or of my Mackie interface?

    NEW QUESTION: With no master track, to use the mastering plugins...do I render to one track and then master that in a subsequent process?
     
  11. CaptainMoto

    CaptainMoto Blues Voyager

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2012
    Messages:
    8,138
    Likes Received:
    6,438
    It's a little difficult to interpret and respond to queries here so I'll do my best.
    If I miss something don't hesitate to reply.

    You can apply any plug in on the "main" channel in Studio One.
    When you're in the Mix View, it's the last fader on the far right side , after all the other faders for each of the other tracks.
    There won't be a track displayed in the time line but, all tracks are summed in the Main so, whatever you drag/drop on that will be applied as if it was a master track.
    Using your example, if you wanted to use Neutron on the finished track, just drop it on the Main.

    I'm working on my laptop right now (No Studio One) I'll move over to my desktop and send a follow up picture to help demonstrate that.
     
  12. Elwood

    Elwood -----------

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2018
    Messages:
    857
    Likes Received:
    846
    I got a minute after dinner... the master track is a function of Reaper. I spent some time in Reaper. I was just dumbstruck, there were so many changes going on with new equipment and DAW. I would have noticed as soon as I tried to something other than VJR. You know what I mean, if I were mixing up a tune, after I get my tracks down I would have been gazing at the screen for sure. That probably hasn't changed though.

    Now, I need to find that tip on how to adjust volume on part of a track in S1. I'll be needing that one soon. :Beer:
     
  13. CaptainMoto

    CaptainMoto Blues Voyager

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2012
    Messages:
    8,138
    Likes Received:
    6,438
    Follow up to previous post:
    MAIN.jpg
    MIX MAST.jpg
     
    Elwood likes this.
  14. CaptainMoto

    CaptainMoto Blues Voyager

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2012
    Messages:
    8,138
    Likes Received:
    6,438
    Here's a Tip on that:
    http://bluesguitarunleashed.com/forum/index.php?threads/favorite-tips.30587/ Volume 1.jpg

    MikeS, moved some tips to the "Sticky", http://bluesguitarunleashed.com/forum/index.php?threads/favorite-tips.30587/
    There is a second set of tips there on using Automation but, for some reason they come up as errors.
     
  15. Elwood

    Elwood -----------

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2018
    Messages:
    857
    Likes Received:
    846
    @MikeS Help! When I go to the table in that "sticky" (see post above) I get user log in errors on all of Moto's tips. :( Please take a look at that.
    Thanks. :Beer:
     
  16. PapaRaptor

    PapaRaptor The Central Scrutinizer
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2010
    Messages:
    7,143
    Likes Received:
    11,314
    I restored @CaptainMoto's original posts for reference until it gets all properly sorted out.
     
    Elwood likes this.
  17. MikeS

    MikeS Allen, TX
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2009
    Messages:
    4,192
    Likes Received:
    3,124
    Since all I have is an admin id, I didn't realize that there might be security issues for non-admins. As Llpyd suggested, I changed all the links to attachment back to links to the thread.
    The main reason I didn't do that to begin with was that if there are two questions answered in the same thread, I don't know how to link to a specific post, just the entire thread.

    UPDATE... Thanks to @PapaRaptor, I now know how to point to an individual post within a thread. Thanks Lloyd!
     
    #17 MikeS, Aug 2, 2020 at 8:23 AM
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2020 at 8:54 AM
    Elwood and CaptainMoto like this.