Lesson Suggestion - Comping With Triads

[MikeR]

We have a number of references to comping with two-note chiks, or little chords (which could be triads), but I'd like to see a mini-course on comping with variations of triads, both major and minor. I know some, but when I'm at a jam and someone plays something a little out of the ordinary, I fall back on barre chords.

 

[PapaBear]

I just took a course on that by Rob Garland over at Truefire, it was a good outline could have been a little more in depth, looked at Murnahan's course I have Triads and the blues as a follow up, but Bob is so hard to follow, he gets side tracked and over explains some things. Rob's course tied the shapes into the caged progression, but will leave you to do a lot of study and practice on your own.(which ain't a bad thing) I take songs I know and try to find other places to play them.

 

[MikeR]

I've got Robert Renman's course (Comping The Blues), which isn't bad. I'd like to have Griff's take on it.

 

[Randy S]

If you are thinking Blues- Griff did a blog lesson on 4 of the 5 shapes for Dom7 chords using just the top 4 strings. The lesson was actually about using chords in solos but is applicable to rhythm also. Here is the link:

https://bluesguitarunleashed.com/blog/using-chord-inversions-for-solos/

If you are thinking something other than Blues I don't know of a lesson but I do know a methodology- can't remember where I learned it. Play the shape of your usual barre chord (or any CAGED chord) but just play the top 4 strings. You may or may not end up with an inverted chord where the root is not in the bass but in a band setting with a bass player that shouldn't matter. It is an extension of Griff's "little chords" methodology for the Blues- maybe that's where I learned it. Works for most Major, minor, Major 7, minor 7, and Dom 7 chords.

 

[Griff]

I'm a little curious... what makes comping with triads different than just using different chords?

Are we talking about stuff like using Gmin triad over a c7 because it's the 5,b7 and 9 of the chord? I don't really think that way, to be honest. At least, not very often

 

[PapaBear]

To me it's a help with little chords , learning the chords in 3 or 4 string shapes and where the fall in the caged patterns along with the scales. But, not that I wouldn't use them for blues, that isn't my primary motivation for learning them. When I'm jamming with a group of guys I want to do something different

 

[PapaBear]

I'm a little curious... what makes comping with triads different than just using different chords?
1
1Are we talking about stuff like using Gmin triad over a c7 because it's the 5,b7 and 9 of the chord? I don't really think that way, to be honest. At least, not very often

As to the second part of your response no, I tried to get into Bobs course on that and my brain went wonky

 

[PapaBear]

A lesson only fills with thirds and sixths wouldn't be bad either

 

[MikeR]

To me it's a help with little chords , learning the chords in 3 or 4 string shapes and where the fall in the caged patterns along with the scales. But, not that I wouldn't use them for blues, that isn't my primary motivation for learning them. When I'm jamming with a group of guys I want to do something different

That's kind of where I'm headed. I don't know anything about theory (which is likely my problem), so maybe a better way would be to look at it as an expansion on little chords, basically just using the GBE or DGB strings. This isn't blues, but it's what I'm looking at:

 

[MarkDyson]

FWIW I found triads pretty cool to study, and useful when I was working at figuring out how chord fragments were picked out from the mix. I can't remember where I found this document but it was rather useful to me:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/5eejs8fasdbui0h/Lead Secrets-Triads.pdf?dl=1

 

[Griff]

So, I don't intend this to be crass or cheeky, I have a genuine question because I need to know how y'all are approaching this...

For those of you, @MarkDyson, @MikeSRC, @PapaBear, that have chimed in (and anyone else who's interested)

1 - Have you been through Lesson 29 in BGU and absorbed that at all?
2 - Can you play the 5 CAGED shapes up to speed yet (60bpm) on any chords (doesn't have to be the whole circle of 5ths or 4ths, just on any chords)?

In my mind, these things are just small chunks of the standard chord shapes so I don't really think of them as something different. BUT, if you do, then I can teach this to how you're looking at it (obviously, how I look at it doesn't matter, this is for you.)

 

[MarkDyson]

No worries, Griff! See, what happens with me is the "whole enchilada" overwhelms me, then I pull back and look just at small bits of it. Four note solo. BB Box. Box 1 of the minor pentatonic. Little bite-sized pieces I can chew.

Then, one day, lo and behold, I go back and look at the broader picture and now it makes sense. I need those piecemeal bits first, it's just how I learn.

 

[Norfolk Bill]

like most things in this little chord bit of guitar playing ,,why confuse your self? if you can play the barr chords all this is in there, just play the barr chord fingering but select the strings you hit? or as dictated learn to play the fingerings for the smaller versions, i know where i sit,,, up to you

 

[MarkDyson]

like most things in this little chord bit of guitar playing ,,why confuse your self?

That's precisely why I start with smaller snippets until I accumulate enough of those to form larger constructs. To do otherwise is a path I find vastly confusing.

 

[Griff]

That's precisely why I start with smaller snippets until I accumulate enough of those to form larger constructs. To do otherwise is a path I find vastly confusing.

And that's why I ask

Everyone is different in how they take in and assimilate information. My job isn't to try to get you to see it my way, it's to make it available in yours. That's why I ask so many (seemingly random, I'm sure) questions, because it helps me get into the conversation going on between your ears so I can see it from your perspective.

 

[MarkDyson]

And that's why I ask

And that's why you rock!

Mentally, to me a complex problem can appear as a hopeless snarl, until I find the end of the cord and can tug it out a little way. Then a little more. Over time, I look up and see I've unsnarled a large bit of the problem. That encourages me greatly and helps prevent the proverbial throwing up of the hands.

It's part and parcel of why I approached tone chasing by trying to deconstruct interesting tones: not to cop someone else's sound, but to accumulate those bite-sized bits of understanding until eventually I have a plate full that I can work with.

My fear of the fretboard all but evaporated when, one day, I looked up and realized that, if I were to combine the various bits and bobs I knew, I had most of it already sussed. That's how I circumvent my inner demons.

 

[PapaBear]

Yes I can play the shapes and then pluck just what I want I can even break most of them down to triads, what I'm looking at is embellishments similar to the little wing style of playing, sliding into triads, hammering this note or pulling that one, what's available to add and when, maybe a little lead break, I've been working on it slowly, just thought Mike's suggestion would be handy to speed up the process

 

[MikeR]

Griff, thanks for trying to figure out where I'm going with this. To answer your question:

1 - Yes, but it's been awhile
2 - No

I'm with Mark on the small piece approach. Also Mark, your post of the PDF was very helpful. To answer Bill, I do use barre chords and just strike the higher strings, but due to arthritis, I can't play them for more than short periods of time (like 5 minutes). Also, there more than the 5th and 6th string root barre chord abbreviations to play triads. Also, what about chords like a minor 7th? A top three string abbreviation of a 6th string root barre chord is the same for a minor or a minor 7th. Do some chords require more than 3 notes? Sorry if these are dumb questions. I probably just need to learn some theory.

 

[PapaBear]

That's kind of where I'm headed. I don't know anything about theory (which is likely my problem), so maybe a better way would be to look at it as an expansion on little chords, basically just using the GBE or DGB strings. This isn't blues, but it's what I'm looking at:

Lots of good info in that PDF thanks Mark

 

[Paleo]

Do some chords require more than 3 notes?

You might want to check out Griff's "Guitar Theory Made Useful (And Easy)".

Lesson 6 on Triads (3 notes) and Lesson 7 on "Tall" chords, those with more than 3 notes.