Help needed on lesson 13!

[PaulMarchant]

I have come as far as lesson 13 in the excellent "GTMU" course. I find Griffs explanations very easy to grasp. I do however have a problem with the exercises in lesson 13. In the table for formulas regarding the 7 modes I see that the Locrian mode formula is 1, b2, b3, 4, b5, b6, b7, 1. On page 61 of the book it says that everything is flat but the 4. The answer given in the video for example 13-2 number 6, C# Locrian, is C# D E F# G A B C#, the major scale being C# D# E# F# G# A# B# C#. This seems to correspond to the formula in the table e.g. 1 b2 b3 4 b5 b6 b7 1. Is the statement on page 61, "everything is flat but the 4", a missprint or am I missing something here?

 

[Paleo]

Everything is flat in relation to the root except the 4.

The root doesn't change.

The formulas tell you what happens to the other 6 notes in relation to the root of a Major Scale.

I like to think of the modes in this order:

Lydian: sharp the 4
Ionian = Major = no alteration
Mixolydian: flat the 7
Dorian: flat the 7 and 3
Aeolian: b7, b3, b6
Phrygian: b7, b3, b6, b2
Locrian: b7, b3, b6, b2, b5 = everything from the 2 to 7 is flat except the 4.

Going from Lydian to Ionian you actually lower the #4.
Then from Ionian on down you successively lower another note each time.

If you were to flat the 1 (root) of Locrian (i.e. every note except the 4) you'd actually have the Lydian of a scale a half-step lower than the one you started with and you could start the cycle all over again from the top.

If you lowered the C# to C in the example, you'd be left with an F#, which would be C Lydian.

 

[dvs]

I don't see a contradiction there. Flatting a note means making the note a half-step lower - that doesn't necessarily mean it gains a "flat" symbol. So the phrase "Everything is flat but the 4" means all notes except the 4 are lowered a half step from the corresponding notes of the major scale. It doesn't mean every note but the 4 will be written with a flat symbol (unless you're looking at C-locrian).

 

[Paleo]

Yes. Griff means every note is "flatted" relative to the root except the 4, not every note has a flat in its name.

The question above is asking why the C# doesn't get lowered to C if "everything is flat but the 4".

The "confusion" above is not about flatting a note vs. gaining a flat, since none of the notes in the example going from C# Major to C# Locrian gain a flat in its name.

 

[PaulMarchant]

Thanks all for shedding light on the subject! I now get it!......and can move on! Once more, Thanks for the help!!

 

[PaulMarchant]

Everything is flat in relation to the root except the 4.

The root doesn't change.

The formulas tell you what happens to the other 6 notes in relation to the root of a Major Scale.

I like to think of the modes in this order:

Lydian: sharp the 4
Ionian = Major = no alteration
Mixolydian: flat the 7
Dorian: flat the 7 and 3
Aeolian: b7, b3, b6
Phrygian: b7, b3, b6, b2
Locrian: b7, b3, b6, b2, b5 = everything from the 2 to 7 is flat except the 4.

Going from Lydian to Ionian you actually lower the #4.
Then from Ionian on down you successively lower another note each time.

If you were to flat the 1 (root) of Locrian (i.e. every note except the 4) you'd actually have the Lydian of a scale a half-step lower than the one you started with and you could start the cycle all over again from the top.

If you lowered the C# to C in the example, you'd be left with an F#, which would be C Lydian.

Excellent explanation, thank you!