Blues Progression (Non-Standard)

PCM

Spring, Texas
Hey Griff, Gents and Ladies,

There's a track in UBJV2 called "That Lonesome Train" (Key of D) that is very similar to "Georgia" and a number of other tunes over the years. This particular track has a chord sequence through G#dim7 and Emaj which can also be heard in a number of tunes.

My question is this: What academic/music theory definition allows for the use of those chords when they clearly aren't in the key and don't fall under standard harmony rules? I'm pretty fluent and familiar with the scales, patterns, both major and minor required to solo against the changes. And...I can see the chord tones within the dim7 ( and 4 fret repeat "walk" up or down the neck) and the Emaj and how they fit over applicable scales in the key of D. What I don't understand is the theoretical basis behind both changes.

Inquiring minds would like to know...thanks.

Pete in Texas
 

Paleo

Student Of The Blues
It's got something to do with using the Diminished 7 as a passing chord between the IV & I
and a series of Secondary Dominants leading to D7:

Bm7-E7-A7-D7

A is the V of D, E is the V of A and B is the V of E.

And it's going to require a bit more explaining.
 
B

Bolar

Guest
Could you post the entire progression? Would make it easier to answer.
It sounds like a jazz blues progression, and there are many different variations. They all have in common, that SHR doesn't apply. SHR only applies to strictly diatonic progressions, so it has it's limitations.
 

PCM

Spring, Texas
Could you post the entire progression? Would make it easier to answer.
It sounds like a jazz blues progression, and there are many different variations. They all have in common, that SHR doesn't apply. SHR only applies to strictly diatonic progressions, so it has it's limitations.
D D7 G7 G#DIM7 D Bm(7) E(7) A(7) D7 G7 D7 A7....? (I think that's the way it goes?)

The parentheses around the 7 is there only to indicate a possible option as a dominant 7th or minor 7th. I can't quite tell in the track. Nor do I theoretically know why the G#DIM7 and E is in there. Sounds great though! Noodling through major pentatonic with minor noodles at the ending turn sounds cool.
 
Last edited:
B

Bolar

Guest
First, Paleo is absolutely right about both the G#dim7 and the E7.
If you play something like this on the top 4 strings:
G7 G#dim7 D7
3 4 5
3 3 3
4 4 5
3 3 4
Notice how the voices on each string either stays or moves chromatically up or down. Chromatic movement between notes are always justified, making the G#dim7 the perfect passing chord between the G7 and D7.

The E7 is a secondary dominant ( dominant of the A7).
Whenever you have any chord in a progression it can always be preceeded by it's dominant ( if room, that is).
When the E7 is the V in key of A, the Bm7 is the II, also in the key of A. The Bm7- E7 is a II-V in key of A, leading to the A7.
II-V's are common in jazz and is sometimes used in slow blues to spice it up a bit.
When soloing, you can play it as if it were the standard 3 chord progression, using the pentatonic scale, or you can choose to "play the changes" , which gives you more options outside the pentatonic scale.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Paleo

Student Of The Blues
Charts of all the tracks come with UBJV2.

Click UBJV2 on your courses page, scroll all the way to the bottom under "Downloads". It's the last one.
 

Paleo

Student Of The Blues
Does that require those courses to be on the purchased vs AAP list?
I think you can only download video and audio from courses that you have purchased.

Then a "Golden Ticket" will allow you to "purchase" a course and download it???

However, I think Griff made the manuals for all the courses "downloadable", as he did for the new "The Foreman".

I'm not quite sure, since I've already purchased everything in the catalog.
 
Last edited:

Paleo

Student Of The Blues
Your saying an AAP does not allow for charts and manuals?
I think Griff said he would make the manuals for courses you haven't purchased downloadable, but I'm not sure when or where he said that. Or if he even did say that.

I know you can't download audio and video for courses you don't "own".

"The Foreman" was just added to AAP yesterday and I downloaded the "manual"/PDF. It hasn't been offered for purchase, yet.

Apparently, as Mark has shown, the charts for the jam tracks are not available if you haven't purchased them.

Again, I'm not sure about the manuals since I already "own" everything and can download all of it.

All you can do is check it out.

Go to some other course you haven't purchased and see if there is a "button" to download the manual.

I'd be curious to know if I "heard" Griff correctly.
 
Last edited:

PCM

Spring, Texas
I think Griff said he would make the manuals for courses you haven't purchased downloadable, but I'm not sure when or where he said that. Or if he even did say that.

I know you can't download audio and video for courses you don't "own".

"The Foreman" was just added to AAP yesterday and I downloaded the "manual"/PDF. It hasn't been offered for purchase, yet.

Apparently, as Mark has shown, the charts for the jam tracks are not available if you haven't purchased them.

Again, I'm not sure about the manuals since I already "own" everything and can download all of it.

All you can do is check it out.

Go to some other course you haven't purchased and see if there is a "button" to download the manual.

I'd be curious to know if I "heard" Griff correctly.

At the risk of veering off course from the subject title and more confusion...I have an AAP and "digital delivery" of UBJ on the other portal. I'm fairly computer literate and nowhere do I see a manual or charts...there is the option to download the tracks, just no manuals or charts. Manuals exist for the other courses in both.

Thanks,

Pete in Texas
 

PapaRaptor

Father Vyvian O'Blivion
Staff member
At the risk of veering off course from the subject title and more confusion...I have an AAP and "digital delivery" of UBJ on the other portal. I'm fairly computer literate and nowhere do I see a manual or charts...there is the option to download the tracks, just no manuals or charts. Manuals exist for the other courses in both.

Thanks,

Pete in Texas

If you have purchased UBJ for digital downloads, you should see this screen when you click on the UBJ icon or menu link.
These are snaps of my page and I purchased UBJ when the package was originally released.
digitaldownloadsthumb.jpg

The download section is at the bottom.
Digital-Downloads.jpg

If you do not see this, send a PM to Griff.
 

Paleo

Student Of The Blues
I have an AAP and "digital delivery" of UBJ on the other portal.

Note that my screenshot above (reply #13) is for Volume 2 (the volume originally in question), which contains charts.

Volume 1 did not contain charts.
 
Last edited:
Top