Count with me?
- Thread starter EddieLee
- Start date
snarf
making guitars wish they were still trees
I think it would have to do more with phrasing than anything. Since you emphasize beat 1 (even though we don't start a solo on beat 1, that beat is still emphasized overall), 6/8 would have a beat emphasized twice as often as 12/8. So which beat do the lyrics and melody point to as the most predominant start? Is that point every 6 beats or every 12 beats? That's your difference in 6/8 and 12/8. From the guitar player's perspective, it would be a very subtle distinction. As far as counting, I don't think there's a big difference. As I told a buddy the other day that was trying to learn a new song for his worship team (the song actually shifted from 6/8 to 12/8 for the bridge), just count it in 6 and you should be fine.
Of course, you also may want to wait until some of the more knowledgeable folks show up to answer.
Of course, you also may want to wait until some of the more knowledgeable folks show up to answer.
ChrisGSP
Blues Journeyman
Gee Eddie, that's a good question. My first impulse is to sub-divide the bar - divide by 2 or 4. 6/8 divided by 2 is 3/4 - waltz time. 12/8 divided by 2 is 6/4 and that is nothing like waltz time - divide by 2 again and you get 3/2 which is pretty strange so I would forget it. My point here is to subtly suggest that in my mind, 6/8 and 12/8 are not similar and should not be compared.
So, counting 6/8 as waltz time you get 1, and, uh, 2, and, uh, 1, and, uh, 2, and, uh - two sets of three in each bar. Think Miles Davis's "All Blues".
Griff usually counts 12/8 as "Swing time", in four sets of threes/triplets - 1, and, uh, 2, and, uh, 3, and, uh, 4, and, uh, 1, and, uh, 2, and, uh, 3, and, uh, 4, and, uh. Think Albert King's version of Ray Noble's "The Very Thought of You".
I hope this makes some sense to you, and also hope it's not complete crap
- over to "the more knowledgeable folks" who snarf mentioned.
So, counting 6/8 as waltz time you get 1, and, uh, 2, and, uh, 1, and, uh, 2, and, uh - two sets of three in each bar. Think Miles Davis's "All Blues".
Griff usually counts 12/8 as "Swing time", in four sets of threes/triplets - 1, and, uh, 2, and, uh, 3, and, uh, 4, and, uh, 1, and, uh, 2, and, uh, 3, and, uh, 4, and, uh. Think Albert King's version of Ray Noble's "The Very Thought of You".
I hope this makes some sense to you, and also hope it's not complete crap
- over to "the more knowledgeable folks" who snarf mentioned.
Paleo
Student Of The Blues
Compound meters have groupings of 3. Usually 8th notes.
In 6/8 you have two groups of three per measure: |1 and uh 2 and uh |
In 12/8 you have four: |1 and uh 2 and uh 3 and uh 4 and uh|
9/8 would be 3 groups of 3 : |1 and uh 2 and uh 3 and uh|
Simple meters have groups of 2 or 4.
It's up to the composer considering phrasing, accents and tempo.
In 6/8 you have two groups of three per measure: |1 and uh 2 and uh |
In 12/8 you have four: |1 and uh 2 and uh 3 and uh 4 and uh|
9/8 would be 3 groups of 3 : |1 and uh 2 and uh 3 and uh|
Simple meters have groups of 2 or 4.
It's up to the composer considering phrasing, accents and tempo.
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david moon
Attempting the Blues
you could also have 3/8, where none of the downbeats have any precedence over the others
Al Holloway
Devizes UK
The top number is how many the bottom is what.
So 12/8 and 6/8 are both quavers (1/8 notes).
In 12/8 you get 12 of them in 6/8 6 of them.
So to answer the original question never.
cheers
Al.
So 12/8 and 6/8 are both quavers (1/8 notes).
In 12/8 you get 12 of them in 6/8 6 of them.
So to answer the original question never.
cheers
Al.
I used to see a lot of waltzes in 3/4 and 6/8 when I was a kid playing another instrument. I don't think I've played a waltz on a guitar.
david moon
Attempting the Blues
songs in 3/4 (thanks Google):
- “Gravity” — John Mayer.
- “You and Me” — Lifehouse.
- “Manic Depression” — Jimi Hendrix.
- “Perfect” — Ed Sheeran.
- “Waltz #2 (X/O)” — Elliot Smith.
- “Nothing Else Matters” — Metallica
Ok, I thought we ere talking about blues here.
Can't help Falling In Love (Elvis =) is 6/8, but that ain't blues either.
david moon
Attempting the Blues
6/8 vs 3/4 might be a judgement call
Also some contributions from the country world
Patsy Cline Tennesee Waltz
Lefty Frizzel
And Willie's
fixed the link to willie
Also some contributions from the country world
Patsy Cline Tennesee Waltz
Lefty Frizzel
And Willie's
fixed the link to willie
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Paleo
Student Of The Blues
Because we "normally" have 4 beats in a measure in a "standard" blues.
6/8 only has 2 beats per measure, as does 2/4.
david moon
Attempting the Blues
Gravity is pretty bluesey. Not a standard progression, but still.
david moon
Attempting the Blues
Not to beat this to death
3/4 vs 6/8 usualliy depends on the tempo. 3/4 might be used for a slower waltz tempo. 6/8 for something more energetic.
12/8 or 4/4 with a shuffle feel when the chords change on 4 beat boundaries
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmxbVeuyIVc
3/4 vs 6/8 usualliy depends on the tempo. 3/4 might be used for a slower waltz tempo. 6/8 for something more energetic.
12/8 or 4/4 with a shuffle feel when the chords change on 4 beat boundaries
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmxbVeuyIVc
Attachments
I would write 'Gravity' in 6/8 or 12/8 all day long... if you listen to the drums and the bass I don't think you could ever call that 3/4 time.
In 3/4, the downbeat is beat 1 of EVERY measure. So when you hear kick on 1, then snare on 1, then kick on 1, then snare on 1, that's not 3/4, that's 6/8 or 12/8... at least, that's how I figure it.
In 3/4, the downbeat is beat 1 of EVERY measure. So when you hear kick on 1, then snare on 1, then kick on 1, then snare on 1, that's not 3/4, that's 6/8 or 12/8... at least, that's how I figure it.
david moon
Attempting the Blues
Might depend on where in the beat the chord changes occur
At a slow waltz tempo, 1 & u, 1 & u (3/4)
At a faster tempo could be 1 & u 2 & u (6/8)
Or 12/8 1& u 2 & u 3 & u 4 & u (4/4 with a 12/8 shuffle feel)
At a slow waltz tempo, 1 & u, 1 & u (3/4)
At a faster tempo could be 1 & u 2 & u (6/8)
Or 12/8 1& u 2 & u 3 & u 4 & u (4/4 with a 12/8 shuffle feel)