Live Sound Thanks Drumtrucker! Thanks SOOOO much!

MikeS

MikeS

Student Of The Blues
Staff member
Now, that may sound like I'm not really thanking him, but in fact he called me the other day, and I don't know if he was poking the GAS bear or if he actually wanted to help, but we talked about the Bose S1 Pro speaker. Another friend had mentioned them to me just before they were released and it sounded interesting for my solo gigs.
A bit of my PA history:
When I started doing solo gigs I went out and bought 2 QSC K12 speakers and a Yamaha MG206c mixer plus all the poles and cables needed. After packing up at 3 am after two gigs, I decided that I REALLY didn't need that massive a sound system, so I bought the Bose L1 1S B2. A fairly compact system. The B2 is the bass module and the "2" indicates that it has two woofers. The damn thing is HEAVY, so I bought the smaller (and lighter) B1.
I've been using this Bose system for about 3 years, but even IT is starting to feel like too much. (Amplifier base, 2 piece speaker mast, Bass module, Tone Match controller (mixer)... at least 2 trips to the car )

So... when Drumtrucker let me know that the new S1 Pro was available it immediately filled my GAS tank.
I've always been amazed by the sound that the several Bose products I own can produce, so I took a leap of faith.
Now, the S1 Pro is small, I mean REALLY small. Like 12x10x11" and 15.7 lbs (Lighter if it will work without the Li battery pack), but (at least in my 10x12 room) it sounds amazing and I can't run it above 25%. My gig last night WOULD have been the perfect place to try it out, but it didn't show up till this afternoon.
I'll try to remember to post again after I've used it at a gig.
 
CaptainMoto

CaptainMoto

Blues Voyager
Those look great, demos sound good.
Sure is light!
I'll be interested in your review, particularly given your experience with the other Bose systems.
I'm wondering is the new S1 will push the sound out as far as the others do.

Hope it delivers for you(y)
 
MikeS

MikeS

Student Of The Blues
Staff member
Their FAQ says that given the fewer speakers, it will not "push the sound as far, but in the venues like small to medium sized bars, I'm hoping it will work fine.
Given its smaller size, does the S1 Pro system project sound as far as the L1 Compact system?
The S1 Pro multi-position PA system produces horizontal coverage that is comparable to that of L1 systems. Longer line arrays, such as those found in these systems, can project sound further with less drop-off of sound levels than the smaller array found in the S1 Pro.
Click to expand...
 
MikeS

MikeS

Student Of The Blues
Staff member
CaptainMoto said:
Waiting for the full official report.
Click to expand...
I'm afraid that it will have to wait several weeks. I have a tentative solo gig on 6/30, then again on 7/6 & 7/7
I should have a good handle on how well it works by then.
I took it out last night to see how it would work as a monitor but I had a really strange PA configuration last night, so it was an awful mix. (Some stuff going through my Bose T1 Tone Match Mixer and other mics going through my PreSonus Studio Live AR8. I was in a rush and not thinking so I only connected the speaker to one of the mixers)

For my solo gigs I need a mixer that can provide 2 (XLR) vocal channels, 1 (TS) guitar channel and one (R/L TS) stereo channel for my tracks. The S1 Pro alone doesn't supply that. It only has 2 XLR and 1 1/8" TRS/ Bluetooth channel, so I'm also thinking of using the T1 Tone Match mixer in front of the S1 Pro to provide more ports. I'll test that out when I get a separate power supply for the T1.
 
MikeS

MikeS

Student Of The Blues
Staff member
Still no "Live fire" test, but I got the power adapter for my Bose T1 Mixer in the mail today and just tested it with my S1 speaker in my 10x12 room.
It looks like it's going to be outstanding for my solo gigs (an maybe even for my bigger gigs as a monitor).
So I've gone from my L1 2S at 75 lbs (not counting the TSA case for the speakers...at least another 10-15 lbs)
Down to 15 Lbs for the S1 speaker.
My back will thank me later.
 
MikeS

MikeS

Student Of The Blues
Staff member
Well I took my new Bose S1 Pro out as the only speaker for my gig last night.
If you are interested in what happened gigwize, here's the link: Last night
Based on last night, I'd say I got mixed results.
I'm not a sound guy so I don't know the right terms but there seemed to be less "presence" or a less full sound.
Don't get me wrong, it did ok and maybe if I wasn't used to hearing my Bose L1-1S system I'd never have noticed anything, but even the manager came to me and said it sounded "thin".
I use the same Bose T1 mixer for both the L1-1S and the S1 Pro. I just plugged in and played. That may have been my mistake. After my first set, I tweaked the EQ on each T1 channel (Less treble less base, more mids) and it sounded better (to my ear, still not as good as the L1-1S ).
I hope that I can get the EQ on the T1 mixer set for the L1-1S and adjust the EQ on the S1 Pro so that I don't have to mess too much with EQing the mixer for each set up.

With the L1-1S coming in at around 97 lbs and the S1 Pro at 15 lbs, I'm gonna keep tweaking the S1 Pro for a few more gigs, because I'm usually bent over a 100 year old after schlepping that 97 lb monster after a gig. Today may back just feels like a normal 67 year old back after a late night. I have a gig at a different venue on Saturday the 30th so I'll play with it some til then and see how it sounds on Saturday.
 
CaptainMoto

CaptainMoto

Blues Voyager
MikeS said:
Well I took my new Bose S1 Pro out as the only speaker for my gig last night.
If you are interested in what happened gigwize, here's the link: Last night
Based on last night, I'd say I got mixed results.
I'm not a sound guy so I don't know the right terms but there seemed to be less "presence" or a less full sound.
Don't get me wrong, it did ok and maybe if I wasn't used to hearing my Bose L1-1S system I'd never have noticed anything, but even the manager came to me and said it sounded "thin".
I use the same Bose T1 mixer for both the L1-1S and the S1 Pro. I just plugged in and played. That may have been my mistake. After my first set, I tweaked the EQ on each T1 channel (Less treble less base, more mids) and it sounded better (to my ear, still not as good as the L1-1S ).
I hope that I can get the EQ on the T1 mixer set for the L1-1S and adjust the EQ on the S1 Pro so that I don't have to mess too much with EQing the mixer for each set up.

With the L1-1S coming in at around 97 lbs and the S1 Pro at 15 lbs, I'm gonna keep tweaking the S1 Pro for a few more gigs, because I'm usually bent over a 100 year old after schlepping that 97 lb monster after a gig. Today may back just feels like a normal 67 year old back after a late night. I have a gig at a different venue on Saturday the 30th so I'll play with it some til then and see how it sounds on Saturday.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the report Mike.
That sounds a little disappointing but, I'm not surprised by your assessment.
Keep that tip jar full and you can hire a roadie for the heavy stuff.
I'm too damn old to stay up late.
 
OG_Blues

OG_Blues

Guitar Geezer
I have resorted more and more to using a cart with good ball bearing wheels or a hand truck for moving heavy stuff around as I get older.
There comes a time when pretending I'm still a teenager just doesn't work very well any longer, or I suffer the next day (or week).
 
MikeS

MikeS

Student Of The Blues
Staff member
I reread some notes on the S1 Pro and I tried changing from a standard TS guitar cable to a TRS and I think it may sound better ( hard to tell in my living room)
 
Griff

Griff

Vice Assistant General Manager
Staff member
At the risk of getting nerdy... "thin" usually equates to the curve that people like to hear under 200Hz.

For YEARS I assumed that what I wanted was a "flat" response from my speakers. And while that may be accurate... it's not a pleasant sound.

A couple of years ago I stumbled upon the Harman Ideal Response Curve (link for the nerds - https://www.innerfidelity.com/content/acoustic-basis-harman-listener-target-curve) which basically shows that what people like to hear is a large bump in the low area under 200 Hz, and then a steady rise up until around 3K, then a steady descent to 10K and beyond.

Using a series of test tones and pink noise, I was able to setup and EQ for my in-ear-monitors that closely resembled that ideal response and it was a REMARKABLE difference in how much I enjoyed listening throughout the night.

I've since gone on to use an RTA mic to get similar, general EQ curves for most of my speakers and I believe the sound has improved dramatically now over where it used to be.

I don't know what type of EQ'ing you have available in that rig, but using a Behringer Ultracurve and an RTA mic (I have a dbx one, I think they're around $100) you can get much closer to the ideal sound curve and fill it out nicely.

You can also just use a frequency analyzer in your phone and run pink noise through it... but the phone won't be very accurate. Might do the job, however, on the cheap :)
 
MikeS

MikeS

Student Of The Blues
Staff member
Pretty sure there's a parametric EQ in the Bose T1 mixer, but only Bass & Treble on the speaker itself.
are the EQ numbers just for vocals or on all channels? (guitar, Tracks & vocals)
Pink noise????? Not sure what that is, but I'm SURE that Lloyd will know he's a pink strap kinda guy.
 
Marv

Marv

I play 'err' guitar.
MikeS said:
Well I took my new Bose S1 Pro out as the only speaker for my gig last night.
After my first set, I tweaked the EQ on each T1 channel (Less treble less base, more mids) and it sounded better (to my ear, still not as good as the L1-1S ).
Click to expand...

A passage in the article (or one of the embedded articles) caught my eye. It suggested that older people prefer more treble (hearing loss?) than younger people, who prefer both more bass and more treble. Since that's the opposite of what you did, I figured I'd mention it. Also, maybe consider your age and the age of the manager? Instead of trusting what you hear, you might also ask some of the younger folks in the audience how they would adjust the sound, if they could. :whistle:
 
MikeS

MikeS

Student Of The Blues
Staff member
I had my second run with my Bose S1 Pro speaker last night.
This time I used a stereo (TRS) guitar cable to go from the Bose T1 mixer Master Out to channel 1 on the S1 Pro.
I think that it made a big difference. I had the S1 Pro set dead center for volume and my T1 Mixer Master at maybe 10 o'clock. It was plenty loud for the room (maybe a couple of thousand sq ft).\
With either Bose system (S1 Pro or L1 1S) I have no need for a monitor. I don't know how Bose does it but I hear everything just fine.
@drumtrucker was there, so maybe he can add his comments on the sound.
 
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